Is Crunch or Close Combat better on Zacian-Crowned in Gen 8 AG and Nat Dex AG?

Question

Close Combat is what I use, but my friend says that Crunch is better becauseit does more damage against Necrozma Dusk Mane.
So which move is better to use in the Gen 8 AG and Nat Dex AG?
Other moves: Behemoth Blade, Wild Charge, Play Rough/Swords Dance

Answer 1

It doesn't do higher damage because of Prism Armor. The ability makes Crunch do 1.5x damage instead of 2x, so it is:
80 x 1.5 = 120

As you can see, it's having same damage as Close Combat. Calcs for that:

• +1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Crunch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Prism Armor Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 160-190 (40.2 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

• +1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 160-189 (40.2 - 47.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Source
The damage is very close, so no, it doesn't do more damage to NDM. On second note, it also comes to hitting Lunala + Preserving defense stats vs OHKOing Ferrothorn / Dialga / stuff, etc.

In that case, if it's a bulkier set then you should go with Crunch. Close Combat is always the option on faster, standard sets because Ferrothorn is more common than Lunala anyways. It won't care about defense drops much as it cares about picking OHKOes and not other things. So ultimately, it comes to be based on the set.

Here's a bulky Zacian set with Crunch (courtesy of Zayele):

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 208 HP / 20 Atk / 204 Def / 76 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Behemoth Blade
- Play Rough
- Crunch

The EVs allow it to tank 2 Earthquakes from Defensive NDM and survive a +2 Max Lightning from Xerneas at full HP. Play Rough over Wild Charge because hitting Zygarde is more important than Ho-Oh.

However, if you do not want to hit Lunala, instead go for Ferrothorn and don't hurt its wallbreaking prowess, the standard moves with 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe and Close Combat is what you should aim for.

Hope this helps!

Comments

Also, I’d like to mention that crunch hits Shedinja and defensive Solgaleo, and while they’re very uncommon, it can still help

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Good point, thanks but mentioning Lunala is enough imo. Those two are very rare and wacky counters as both fear Assurance so not really much important.

Answer 2

Close-Combat : it has much better power, and ZC is fast and it hits hard so you don’t need to worry too much about stat decrease.

Some calculations: +1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 214-252 (63.8 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Close Combat vs. +1 24 HP / 0 Def Zamazenta-Crowned: 382-450 (115.4 - 135.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

As you can see Close Combat is a lot better.

Comments

Zamazenta crown isn't used in ag, where Zacian dominates;

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And also im describing max hp max def ndm, the zacian -c check?

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I have given u calculations with maximum defense and HP

Answer 3

This is a good question to think about but there is no doubt for me to answer this.

Crunch-
Power:80
Accuracy:100
PP-24

Close Combat-
Power:120
Accuracy:100
PP:8

Crunch damage claculations against defensive NDM
> +4 252+ Atk Zacian Crunch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Prism Armor Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 262-309 (65.9 - 77.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Close Combat damage claculation against Defensive NDM
>+4 252+ Atk Zacian Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 262-309 (65.9 - 77.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So both Crunch and Close Combat after Swords dance have same effect on a defensive NDM.

So you can go with Cose Combat as it gives the most type coverage than Crunch.

So Close Combat is what I Recommend to have.

Hope I Helped

Comments

Thx for answering. I didnt see urs as i was typing out mine.

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after Swords Dance it would be +3, not +4.

Answer 4

I realised the answer after doing calcs.
+1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Crunch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Prism Armor Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 160-190 (40.2 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 160-189 (40.2 - 47.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
I completely forgot abt prism armor which makes the damage almost the same.

Crunch has no coverage while close combat does. The def drop shouldn't be such a huge concern so close combat is better. The end.

Do I hide my question? I feel like I should.

Comments

Don't hide it, it could help others in the future. Select whichever answer you think is the best (even if that's your own), and keep it up. You can hide it if you want, but there's no point.